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İ-DKP Başkanı Mustafa Hejri İle Röportaj-Hülya Yetişen


İ-DKP Başkanı Mustafa Hejri İle Röportaj-Hülya Yetişen

Irak Kürdistanı’nda Peşmerge ordu güçlerimiz vardır. Hatırlatılması gerekirki şu anda İran İslam Cumhuriyeti’ne yönelik silahlı mücadelemizi askıya aldık.
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Qazî Mihemed'in Kürd Ulusuna Vasiyeti


Qazî Mihemed'in Kürd Ulusuna Vasiyeti

Zulüm ve baskı gören halkım!

Yüce Allah aşkına vaatlere artık kanmayın. Çünkü onlar ne Allah'ı tanıyorlar, ne peygambere, ne kıyamet gününe, ne Allah huzurunda hesap vermeye inanıyorlar. Onların nezdinde, Müslüman da olsanız, Kürt olduğunuz için suçlusunuz, onların düşmanısınız

Kurd li Misrê - Nezîr Silo


Kurd li Misrê - Nezîr Silo

Misr yek ji welatên ku herî peywendîdar bû ji demek dirêj ve di nav dewletên erban de bi Kurdan re.

MEHMET BAYRAK İLE SÖYLEŞİ  


22-11-2010, 19:40 Kategori: Röportaj, Hülya Yetişen  
Hülya Yetişen

MEHMET BAYRAK İLE SÖYLEŞİ


Mehmet Bayrak Kimdir?

Mehmet. Bayrak, 1948 yılında , Yaşar Kemal’in eserlerinde çokça işlediği Binboğa Dağları eteklerindeki Alevi-Kürt köyü Dallıkavak’ta doğdu. 1953’te kayıtsız olarak devam ettiği ilkokula gittiğinde, Türkçenin (T)sini bilmiyordu. Ders yılının ikinci yarısında okula kaydedildiğinde henüz beş yaşındaydı. O tarihten sonra, anadili Kürtçe’yi öyle bir bıraktı ki, bu talihsiz sürecin izlerini hâlâ üzerinde taşıyor. Ortaokulu ve Liseyi, Kayseri’de okuduğunda; Türk ve İslâm eksenli ikili mahalle baskısını iliklerinde yaşadı...1965’te başladığı Üniversite eğitimini Ankara’da Dil ve Tarih- Coğrafya Fakültesi Türkoloji Bölümünde tamamladı. Daha ilk yıl Türkiye İşçi Partisi’ne üye oldu. Kürt, Alevi kökenli olması ve içinde yer aldığı Sosyalist dünya görüşü, benzerleri gibi onun da sonraki yaşamını ve çalışmalarını biçimlendirdi.

Üniversiteyi, çalışarak okudu. Bu, emeği daha bir bilinçle savunmasını birlikte getirdi. Türkoloji eğitimini, öğrenci boykotları nedeniyle 1970’te tamamladıktan bir yıl sonra yazmaya başladı. 1971’de, dönemin eski ve yeni kuşak sosyalistlerini biraraya getiren Gelecek dergisindeki ilk yazısı da, 1973’te Asım Bezirci’nin önerisiyle bir yayınevi adına hazırladığı ilk kitap çalışması da, toplumcu- hümanist şair ve aydın Tevfik Fikret’le ilgiliydi. O tarihten itibaren 40 yıla yakındır sürekli yazıyor ve bugüne kadar yayımlanmış 25 eseri bulunuyor. Eserleri Türkoloji, Kürdoloji ve Alevilik alanlarında.

1988/89 yıllarında çıkardığı Özgür Gelecek Dergisi’nin ve Yayınlarının serüveni ise oldukça uzun . Burada, ayrıntıya girmeye gerek yok...

Mehmet Bayrak'ın yayınlanmış kitaplarını görmek için http://www.ozgeyayinevi.com/ adresini ziyaret ediniz
***** 
Hülya Yetişen: Mehmet Bey, ülkenin en ciddi ve yakıcı meselesi olan Kürt meselesinin, Türkiye’de bilimsel uğraşın ve çalışma alanının dışında tutulduğunu biliyoruz. Sergilenen suskunluğun, farklılaşma ve tartışma ortamıyla kısmi de olsa bozulduğunu, Kürtlere ve Kürt meselesine yönelik olumlu ilginin arttığını görüyoruz. Araştırmalarınız, sistematik, örgütlü yalan bilgi üretimine karşı bilimsel bir duruşu simgeliyor. Biz de araştırmalarınızdan yola çıkarak sorularımızı iki ana başlık altında topladık. Birincisi, Cumhuriyet Türkiyesi’nin Kürt Politikası... Buradan hareketle şöyle bir soruyla başlayalım, Kemalizm bir ideoloji mi? Kemalizm’in çekirdeğini oluşturan temel unsurlar nedir?

Mehmet Bayrak:Kemalizm, ister bir ideoloji isterse bir doktrin olarak nitelendirilsin, Cumhuriyet dönemi boyunca devletin resmi ideolojisinin adıdır. Bilindiği gibi, hem Mustafa Kemal’in kendisi hem de asker ve sivil kadrolarının yüzde 90/95’i , önceki İttihad ve Terakki Hareketi’nin devamıdır. Kendisi, 1912’de yeniden biçimlendirilen devlet aygıtında Milli Emniyet Teşkilatı’nda istihbarat subayı olarak çalışacak kadar bu harekete yakındır. Sonradan bu hareketi reddeder görünerek ortaya çıkması, tamamen diğer muhalif unsurların ve en başta da Kürtler’in desteğini almaya çalışmaktan kaynaklanmaktadır ve bunu da başarmıştır.

Bu ideoloji, İttihad ve Terakki Hareketi’nce temelleri atılan “Tek tip toplum” esasına dayanmaktadır ve bu nedenle de tarihsel ve toplumsal gerçekliğe terstir. Devlet eliyle zorla bir “Türk” milleti yaratılmaya çalışıldığı için, Osmanlı’dan devralınan “milliyetler” olgusuna ters düşülmış; “Hanefi Müslümanlığı” eksenli bir devlet dini yaratılmak istendiği için devam edegelen dinsel/inançsal/kültürel yapılanmaya ters düşülmüş; “halk” kavramının arkasına saklanılarak “imtiyazsız- sınıfsız kaynaşmış bir kitle” söylemiyle de sınıf gerçeğine ters düşülmüştür. Bu ülkede, gerek etnik kimliği, gerek inanç kimliği, gerekse sınıf kimliği dolayısıyla insanların ne kadar büyük hasarlar gördüğü ve acılar çektiği gözönüne alınırsa; bu ideolojinin çağdışılığı ve uygarlık karşıtlığı daha iyi anlaşılır...

Hülya Yetişen: Bu ideolojik bağlamda Ulus-Devlet kurulması sürecini deneyimleyen Türkiye’nin, Kürtlerle olan meselesini yerli yerine oturtamamasının tarihsel nedenleri nedir?

Mehmet Bayrak:Hemen belirtelim ki, başka toplumlarda uluslar devletleri kurar ve biçimlendirirken, Türkiye’de bunun tersi bir süreç yaşandı ve devlet zoruyla bir “ulus” yaratılmaya çalışıldı. Açıktır ki, bu, eşyanın tabiatını aykırıydı ve tez zamanda patlak vereceği belliydi. Nitekim, daha 1921 Teşkilat-ı Esasiye Kanunu’nda (Anayasa), Kürtler’e bir çeşit özerklik verilmesi öngörülmüşken; Lozan’ın imzalanmasından sonra çıkarılan 1924 Anayasası’nda bu hak geri çekilmişti. Kongrelerde ve protokollerde belirlenen haklarla, bu konuda gazetecilere yapılan açıklamaları bir yana bırakıyorum.

İşin aslına bakılırsa; Lozan’ın bedeli bütünüyle Kürtler’e ödetilerek, onlar, moda deyimle “ülkesi ve milletiyle” dörde bölündü. Özetle, Kemalist hareket, Lozan’dan sonra yüzündeki maskeyi çıkartarak, eski İttihadçı ilkelerine geri döndü. İttihad ve Terakki Cemiyeti’nin ilk 5 kurucu üyesi Kürt olsa da, özellikle 1912’den sonra izlediği süreç bütünüyle tarihsel ve toplumsal gerçekliğe ters düşüyordu ve Kemalistler de bu mirası hayata geçirmeye çalıştıkları için, bir başka söyleyişle bünyeye uymayan bu deli gömleğini zorla topluma giydirmeye çalıştıkları için; sorun çözen değil, sorun yaratan bir anlayışı ve politikayı bugünlere kadar taşıdılar...

Hülya Yetişen: “Şark Islahat Planı” nedir? Planın oluşturulmasında kimler yer almıştır? Bu Planla oluşturulan Kürt politikasının esasları ve uygulamaları neler olmuştur?

Mehmet Bayrak: Şark Islahat Planı, Kemalist hareketin Kürtler için gizlice biçtiği bir kefendir. Bu Plan’la birlikte, Lozan Antlaşması’nda öngörülenler dahil, önceki vaadlerin tümü geri alındığı gibi; Kürt meselesinin (edeplendirme, hizaya getirme), (cezalandırma), (katletme), (göçürtme, başka yere iskân etme), (asimile etme), (medenileştirme adına Türkler’e benzetme) ve (etkisizleştirme) etme gibi tüm yöntemler kullanılmak suretiyle Kürt kimliği yokedilerek Kürt sorununu çözme ve bu işi askere havale ederek halletme hedeflendiği için, son derece acılı ve sancılı bir süreç izlenerek bugünlere gelindi...

Hülya Yetişen: Lozan Antlaşması’nın 39-45. maddeleriyle Kürtlere sosyal ve kültürel haklar tanındığı, bu görüşmelerde devlet yapısının Türk-Kürt kardeşliği üzerinde inşa edildiği açıkça ifade edildiği halde birlikten yana olan Kürtler neden gözden çıkarıldı?

Mehmet Bayrak: Lozan Antlaşması’yla, Kürtler’in “ülkesi ve milletiyle” dörde bölünmesi yetmiyormuş gibi, sonraki hak gaspları da Güney Kürdistan toprak ve petrollerinin alınamamasına bağlanıyordu. Sözgelimi, Şark Islahat Planı’na ilişkin ön raporlarda, gerek Şark Islahat Komisyonu Başkanı gerekse Genelkurmay İkinci Başkanı elde kalan Türkiye arazisinde iki milletin eşit haklarla yaşamasının mümkün olamayacağını, bu nedenle Türk milletinin her alanda hâkim kılınması gerektiğini iddia ediyorlardı ve Kemalizmin yeni Kürt politikası bu esaslar üzerine inşa edildi...

Hülya Yetişen: Şeyh Said Direnişi, modernite karşıtlığı, dinci-gerici bir isyan olarak okundu, okutuldu. Şeyh Said, Ağrı ve Dersim direnişlerinin arkasında yatan asıl nedenler neydi? Direnişlere önderlik eden Kürt aydınları kimlerdi?

Mehmet Bayrak: Öncelikle belirteyim ki, 1937/38’de Dersim’de yaşananlar bir isyan değil; planlı bir katliamdı. Bir yönüyle, 1919-21 döneminde Kuzeybatı Dersim olarak da nitelendirilen de yaşananların rövanşı ve devamıydı. 1926/27 yıllarında cereyan eden ise, literatüre bilerek olarak sokulmaya çalışılan nin devamıydı. Unutmayalım ki, 1925-27 yılları arasında katledilen insanların sayısı 15 bin dolayındadır. O zamanki Türkiye nüfusu içinde bunun ne denli büyük bir rakam olduğu ise ortadadır. 1925 Kürt Hareketine gelince...Bu konuda, yüzlerce sayfalık gizli belge yayımlamış bir araştırmacı olarak sadece iki belge vermekle yetineyim. Bu belgelerden biri, dönemin Genelkurmay Başkanlığı’nın 30 Nisan 1341 (1925) tarih ve 1835/2270 numaralı tezkeresidir. Sürekli olarak Türkiye yönetiminde söz sahibi olan Genelkurmay Başkanlığı, o tarihte de; 1925 Hareketi’nin iç ve dış basında bir “Kürt milli isyanı” olarak sunulmasının, Türkler’in ve yönetimin milli menfaatlerine aykırı olduğunu söyleyerek, tedbir alınmasını istiyor.

Şark Islahat Planı, Kemalist hareketin Kürtler için gizlice biçtiği bir kefendir. Bu Plan’la birlikte, Lozan Antlaşması’nda öngörülenler dahil, önceki vaadlerin tümü geri alındığı gibi; Kürt meselesinin (edeplendirme, hizaya getirme), (cezalandırma), (katletme), (göçürtme, başka yere iskân etme), (asimile etme), (medenileştirme adına Türkler’e benzetme) ve (etkisizleştirme) etme gibi tüm yöntemler kullanılmak suretiyle Kürt kimliği yokedilerek Kürt sorununu çözme ve bu işi askere havale ederek halletme hedeflendiği için, son derece acılı ve sancılı bir süreç izlenerek bugünlere gelindi...Lozan Antlaşması’yla, Kürtler’in “ülkesi ve milletiyle” dörde bölünmesi yetmiyormuş gibi, sonraki hak gaspları da Güney Kürdistan toprak ve petrollerinin alınamamasına bağlanıyordu. Sözgelimi, Şark Islahat Planı’na ilişkin ön raporlarda, gerek Şark Islahat Komisyonu Başkanı gerekse Genelkurmay İkinci Başkanı elde kalan Türkiye arazisinde iki milletin eşit haklarla yaşamasının mümkün olamayacağını, bu nedenle Türk milletinin her alanda hâkim kılınması gerektiğini iddia ediyorlardı ve Kemalizmin yeni Kürt politikası bu esaslar üzerine inşa edildi...Öncelikle belirteyim ki, 1937/38’de Dersim’de yaşananlar bir isyan değil; planlı bir katliamdı. Bir yönüyle, 1919-21 döneminde Kuzeybatı Dersim olarak da nitelendirilen de yaşananların rövanşı ve devamıydı. 1926/27 yıllarında cereyan eden ise, literatüre bilerek olarak sokulmaya çalışılan nin devamıydı. Unutmayalım ki, 1925-27 yılları arasında katledilen insanların sayısı 15 bin dolayındadır. O zamanki Türkiye nüfusu içinde bunun ne denli büyük bir rakam olduğu ise ortadadır. 1925 Kürt Hareketine gelince...Bu konuda, yüzlerce sayfalık gizli belge yayımlamış bir araştırmacı olarak sadece iki belge vermekle yetineyim. Bu belgelerden biri, dönemin Genelkurmay Başkanlığı’nın 30 Nisan 1341 (1925) tarih ve 1835/2270 numaralı tezkeresidir. Sürekli olarak Türkiye yönetiminde söz sahibi olan Genelkurmay Başkanlığı, o tarihte de; 1925 Hareketi’nin iç ve dış basında bir olarak sunulmasının, Türkler’in ve yönetimin milli menfaatlerine aykırı olduğunu söyleyerek, tedbir alınmasını istiyor.

Genelkurmay’ın isteğini derhal “tezekkür” eden, yani görüşen Hükümet, Genelkurmay’ın önerisini yerinde bularak; “son hareketin bir Kürt milli isyanı değil; bir irtica (gericilik)ve iğfal (kandırma) hareketi” olduğu yolunda yayın yapılması için dönemin Dışişleri Bakanlığı görevlendiriliyor. Unutmayalım ki, hareketin gerçek önderliği Kürdistan Azadi Örgütü’dür. Bu örgütün birçok lideri 1925’te katledildiği gibi; Şeyh Said ve arkadaşları da, günümüzde Öcalan’a yapılan suçlamayla idam edilmişlerdir...

Hülya Yetişen: Sark Islahat Planı’na karşı Kürt aydınlarının ne türden girişimleri oldu? Bu girişimler bir sonuç verdi mi?

Mehmet Bayrak: Kürtler’e daha önce vaadedilen veya öngörülen hakları gasbeden bir gizli Anayasa olarak hazırlanan Şark Islahat Planı’nın ayrıntılarını bütünüyle bilmese de, Kürt aydınları daha o dönemde uygulamalara bakarak, izlenen “kan ve demir siyaseti” nin tümden yanlış olduğunu ve halka felaket getireceğini algılayarak, 1925/26’nın kanlı ortamına rağmen Türk yönetimini uyarmaya çalışıyorlar ki, o zamanki görüş ve öneriler bugün için de tümüyle geçerlidir. Bakınız daha o tarihte getirilen çözüm önerisi nedir: “Tek çözümyolu ve ilaç, 20. yüzyıl medeniyetinin millet ve hürriyet prensiplerine hürmet ve riayet ile Kürtler’e hayat hakkı bahşetmek ve bu suretle Avrupalılar’a, dost ve düşmana karşı tekâmül ve siyasi rüştünü (olgunluğunu ve siyasi yeterliğini MB) göstermektir...”

Buradaki belirlemeler, günümüzde de tüm yakıcılığıyla geçerliliğini korumuyor mu?..

Hülya Yetişen: Katliam’dan kurtulup yurtdışına çıkan Kürt Aydınlarının 20 Mayıs 1926 tarihinde İsmet İnönü’ye gönderdikleri bir muhtıra var. Bu muhtıra neden İnönü’ye gönderildi? Muhtıranın içeriğinde neler vardı?

Mehmet Bayrak: Sözkonusu “Muhtıra-Mektup”, herhalde hem Lozan delegasyonunun lideri, hem dönemin Başbakanı, hem de Kürt kökenli olması dolayısıyla İsmet Paşa’ya gönderilmiş olmalı. Unutmayalım ki, ünlü Kürt aydını Dr. Şükrü Mehmed Sekban da, 1923’te kaleme aldığı “Kürtler, Türkler’den Ne İstiyorlar?” konulu muhtıra-mektubunu, dönemin Diyarbekir Mebusu Fevzi Pirinççizâde aracılığıyla Hükümete göndermişti. Muhtıra’de son derece önemli belirlemeler ve öneriler yer alıyor. Herşeyden önce bu Muhtıra dikkate alınsaydı; ne böylesi düzmece bir tarih yazımına gidilirdi, ne de bugün bir Kürt sorunu olurdu. Muhtırada; Devletin anti-propagandalarına karşılık, Kürt aydınlanma hareketinin gerçek anlamda uygarlık ve Cumhuriyet yanlısı olduğuna vurgu yapılıyor ve üstteki çözüm önerisi getiriliyor.

Hülya Yetişen: 1928’te Kürt Xoybun Örgütü, 1930’da Celadet Ali Bedirhan, 1937’de Dersim Aşiretleri adına Nuri Dersimi, Milletler Cemiyeti Umumi Katipliğine (Birleşmiş Milletler Genel Sekreterliği), 1945’te Xoybun adına Dr. Ahmet Nafiz Yekbun San Fransisco Konferansı’na muhtıralar göndererek Cumhuriyet Türkiye’sinin Kürtlere uyguladığı zulmü uluslararası platforma taşıyorlar. Birçok dilde yazılan bu muhtıraların içeriğinde neler vardı ve sonuçları ne oldu?

Mehmet Bayrak: 1927’de Şam’da kurularak faaliyet yürüten Kürt Bağımsızlık Örgütü XOYBUN, büyük bir katliamdan geçirilen Kürt halkının adeta başlıca umudu ve diplomatik sesidir. Ülke dışındaki Kürt aydın ve örgütlerinin diplomatik girişimleri, başlıbaşına bir inceleme konusudur ve bunları yakın dönemde ilk bilince çıkaran araştırmacılardan biriyim.

1898’deki ilk Kürt kimlikli gazete olan Kurdistan’ı sürgünde çıkaran ve 1900 yılında Kürd Azm-i Kavi Cemiyeti’ ni kuran ve daha birçok demokratik Kürt oluşumuna önayak olan bir kadronun yönettiği Xoybun, dönemin acil gereksinmeleri neyi gerektirmişse o konuda yayın yapmış ve girişimlerde bulunmuştur. Osmanlıca/Türkçe dahil çeşitli dillerde yapılan bu yayınların yaklaşık 10 tanesi, benim aracılığımla günümüz literatürüne kazandırılmıştır.

Bir yurtseverlik ürünü olarak ortaya konan bu yayınların ve girişimlerin, büyük etkisi olduğu kuşkusuz söylenemez. Ancak, arkasız bir halk olarak yine de Kürtler’in sesini ve nefesini uluslararası platformlara taşımada önemli bir işlev yüklendikleri açıktır. Sınırlı bir ses olsa da, Kürt ulusal ve toplumsal mücadelesindeki saygın yerini inkâr etmek mümkün değildir. Çünkü diplomasi, Kürtler’in en çok ihtiyaç duyduğu bir mücadele kulvarıdır...

Hülya Yetişen: 1990’ların başında devlet, GAP dahilinde sosyal projeler oluşturmaya başladı. ÇATOM (Çok Amaçlı Toplum Merkezleri-sanırım şu anda sayıları 23 oldu) gibi.. Cumhuriyetin “tedip ve tenkil destekli asimilasyon” siyasetinin yöntem değiştirdiği söylenebilir mi? Devlet, bu politikasıyla bir sonuca ulaştı mı?

Mehmet Bayrak: “Biz bu filmi önceden de seyrettik” diye bir söz vardır. Şark Islahat Planı’ndan buyana bunun sayısız örneklerini ve uygulamalarını gördük. Solcularımızın bile bir dönem büyük bir “devrim” olarak nitelendirdiği Tevhid-i Tedrisat Kanunu bile bunun bir versiyonu değil mi, aynı zamanda. Kız ve erkek öğrencilerin birarada okuması kuşkusuz güzel; ancak eğitim dilini sadece Türkçe’ye indirgemenin, diğer ana dillerde eğitimin yasaklanmasının neresi devrim allahaşkına!.. Kısaca ÇATOM türü örgütlenmeler, Cumhuriyet dönemi boyunca isim ve kılık değiştirmiş olarak hep yaşandı. Açıktır ki, bu tür örgütlenmeler sınırlı insanı asimile etmede bir konak olarak kullanılsa da, temel sorunları çözmekten çok uzaktır...

Hülya Yetişen: 85 yıllık uygulama sonrasında “Takrir-i Sükun” ve “Şark Islahat Planı”yla biçimlenmiş Kemalizm’in Kürt politikası iflas mı ediyor?

Mehmet Bayrak: Tek kelimeyle, “Evet”...

Hülya Yetişen: Buradan, ikinci başlık olarak düşündüğüm, Kızılbaş (Alevilik) Sorunu'na geçmek istiyorum. Kızılbaşlık (Alevilik) nedir ? Alevilik İslam dışı bir din midir? Tarihsel olarak bu inancın kökleri hangi dönemlere kadar gidiyor?

Mehmet Bayrak: Kızılbaşlık/ Alevilik de, benim çalışma alanlarımdan biridir. 1970’li yıllardan beri bu konuda da kafa yorduğumu söyleyebilirim. Perakende yazılar dışında, 1984’te Alevi Önderlikli Halk Hareketleri’ni işlediğim gibi; 1986’da yayımlanan Pir Sultan Abdal konulu kitabım, Alevi kökenli bir yazar tarafından bu alanda kaleme alınmış ilk çalışmadır. Öte yandan, Kürt Aleviliği ve batıniliğinin (Dr. Cemşid Bender’in yanısıra) ilk kez benim çalışmalarımla bilince çıkarıldığını söyleyebilirim. Alevilik ve Kürtler, Ortaçağ’dan Modern Çağa Alevilik, Alevi- Bektaşi Edebiyatında Ermeni Aşıklar(Aşuğlar), İçtoroslar’da Alevi- Kürt Aşiretler adlı çalışmalarımın tümü bu konularda yoğunlaşmış “farklı” çalışmalardır.

Şunu hemen belirtmeliyim ki; başka konuların yanısıra Alevilik konusunda da, kendisini resmi ideolojiden kurtaramayan yazarların gerçeği algılaması olanaksızdır. Çünkü Kemalizm, bu konuda da bir resmi ideoloji oluşturmuş ve Aleviliği “Türk Müslümanlığı” adıyla Müslümanlık içinde eritmeye çalışmaktadır. Ancak, bu konudaki politikalar da iflas etmiştir.

Bunca çalışmadan sonra geldiğim nokta şudur: Hiçbir dinin başlangıç tarihi tam olarak belli olmamakla birlikte, Aleviliğin binlerce yıllık geçmişe dayanan, doğal-felsefi ve evrensel bir din olduğunu rahatlıkla söyleyebilirim. Felsefe, öğreti, yaşam biçimi, inanç, erkân gibi kavramlar, Aleviliği tek başlarına ifade edemezler. Bunların tümü, Aleviliğin değişik boyutlarıdır. Bunlar olmaksızın dinler olmaz zaten. Aleviliği, semavi dinlerden ayıran temel fark, doğal ve felsefi bir din olmasıdır...

Hülya Yetişen: Kürdistan, Anadolu Aleviliği’yle, Ali yandaşlığı yapan İran-Arap Şiileri arasındaki ayrımı bize açıklar mısınız? Alevilerin Ali kültü ile Halife Ali arasındaki fark nedir?

Mehmet Bayrak: Anadolu, Mezopotamya ve Kürdistan Aleviliği ile İran ve Arap Şiiliği arasında “Ali” ve “12 İmam” sembolleri dışında hiçbir benzerlik yoktur. Arap Şiiliği, iktidar kavgasında doğrudan Halife Ali yandaşlığına dayanmaktadır ki, Arapça’da bunun karşılığı Aleviyyun (Ali yandaşları) ve Aleviyye (Ali yandaşlığı)dır. Oysa, Anadolu ve Kürdistan Kızılbaş/ Aleviliğindeki teslisde (üçte-birleme) yer alan (Haq, Muhammed,Ali) üçlemesi, ya da Hakikatçı Alevilikteki (Haq,Ali, Hüseyin) üçlemesindeki (Ali), tıpkı İsa örneğindeki gibi bir (Tanrı- İnsan) tasarımıdır ve Halife Ali’den köklü biçimde ayrılmaktadır.Başka bir deyişle Alevilik, tamamen farklı bir “Ali kültü” yaratmıştır. Çünkü Halife Ali’nin, kendisini ilahi gücün bir tecellisi olarak sunanları nasıl katlettiği, tarihsel verilerle bilindiği gibi, bizzat Hazret-i Ali Divanı da, bu farklılığın en çarpıcı kanıtıdır...

Zerdüştilik dahil, birçok eski dinde kutsal kabul edilen 12 sayısına, bu inançta, mazlumiyetleri ve mağduriyetleri dolayısıyla, tamamı katledilmiş Ali evlatları sokulmuştur. Yoksa, salt Halife Ali’nin on kadından 33 çocuğunun olduğu bilinmeyen bir şey değildir...

İran’daki Şiilik ise, eski İran dinlerinin İslamiyet formuna sokulmuş ve uyarlanmış şeklidir ve kuşkusuz Arap Şiiliğiyle de büyük benzerlikler göstermektedir.

Hülya Yetişen: Türkiye’de Alevilik bazı bölgelere göre çeşitlilik ve farklılıklar gösteriyor. Bunun politik ve kültürel nedenleri nedir?

Mehmet Bayrak: Değişik halklar arasında örgütlenen inanç ve dinlerin, o halkların ulusal/etnik ve kültürel dokusundan da belli ölçülerde etkileneceği açıktır. Bu, doğal bir oluşumdur. Ne var ki, Osmanlı’nın icazetiyle Hacı Bektaş’tan yaklaşık 200 yıl sonra örgütlenen Bektaşilik; bir yandan Türkmen Aleviler’i, bir yandan Hıristiyan halkları hedef olarak aldığı ve bunları hem Müslümanlığa, hem de Saray’a yakınlaştırma gibi bir misyon üstlendiği için, doğal akışın dışına çıkmıştır. Ancak, gerek 200 yıl önce bu tekkelerin kapatılması, gerekse iletişim araçlarının yaygınlaşması sonucudur ki, yeni durum birçok savrulmaya da yolaçmıştır.

Kitabi din mensupları arasında bile birçok farklar olabildiğine göre, Alevilik gibi daha çok sözlü gelenekle yaşayan bir inançta bu farklılıkları doğal karşılamak gerekiyor.

Hülya Yetişen: Alevi Kürt kimliğini azınlıklar içinde nasıl tanımlayabiliriz?

Mehmet Bayrak: “Alevi-Kürt kimliği” bir “azınlık içinde azınlık” kimliğidir. Çünkü Alevi Kürtler, ulusal planda Türkler içinde azınlık, Alevi olarak Müslümanlar içinde azınlık, Alevi- Kürt olarak, Müslüman Kürtler içinde azınlıktadır. Bu durumdaki kimliklere, biz, “azınlık içinde azınlık kimliği ” diyoruz. Ezidi Kürtler, Ahlê Haq, Kakai , Yaresan ve Musevi Kürtler de bu kategoriye giriyor.

Hülya Yetişen: Mustafa Kemal, Cumhuriyetin kuruluşundan sonra Diyanete verdiği talimatta, Kur’an’ın Türk İslam geleneğine göre tefsir (yorumlama) ve tercüme edilmesini istiyor. Kitabınızda da verilen bu tefsir sözleşmesinin içeriği nedir?

Mehmet Bayrak: Osmanlı Devleti’nin Evkaf ve Şeriye Nezareti lağvedilmiş ve yerine Vakıflar ile Diyanet teşkilatları kurulmuştur. M. Kemal, İttihad’dan devraldığı “tek tip toplum” amacını gerçekleştirmek için, bu kez Diyanet İşleri Başkanlığı ile Müslümanlar’ın kutsal kitabı Kuran’ı da harekete geçirmekte, yani rejimin emrine sokmaktadır. Nitekim, Diyanet’e verdiği bir direktifte; Kuran’ın büyük paralar karşılığı yeni yaptırılacak tercüme ve tefsirinde, gerek Aleviliğe, gerekse Hanefi mezhebi dışındaki diğer Sünni mezheplerin görüşlerine yer verilmemesini ve Kuran’ın, Türk- İslam Geneleği gözönünde bulundurularak tercüme ve tefsir edilmesini istiyor ki, Türk- İslam Sentezi’ nin temeli de esas olarak böyle atılıyor...

Hülya Yetişen: Günümüzde Kızılbaşlığın (Aleviliğin) konumlandığı yeri nasıl tarif edebiliriz?

Mehmet Bayrak: Her zaman söylediğim bir söz var: Toplumsal gelişme yasaları, tüm yasaların üzerindedir. Kürt meselesinde olduğu gibi, burada da aynı şey gerçekleşiyor. Binlerce yıldan bu yana değişik ad ve kimliklerle devam eden, tüm katliam, baskı, yıldırma ve asimilasyon çabalarına rağmen bugüne kadar biteremediğiniz bir toplumu; “sözde laik” ve asimilasyoncu bir yapılanmayla bitiremezsiniz. Bir kimliği tasfiye amacıyla başvurduğunuz acımasız yöntemler, gün olur yeni bir uyanışa kapı açar... Sivas’taki katliam Devleti ele verir ve Alevi örgütlenmesinde bir patlama yaratır. Gazi katliamı, Devleti düpedüz suçüstü yakalatır... Ecevit’in gizli kasasından çıkan bir belge, Devlet aygıtlarının Maraş katliamındaki rolünü ortaya koyar. Küçük çaplı bir Ergenekon soruşturması, derin devletin tüm Alevi katliamlarındaki rolünü bilince çıkarır.

Ve nihayet, İttihad ve Terakki hareketinin en yakın takipçisi konumundaki CHP’nin Genel Başkan Yardımcısı Onur Öymen, “şecaat arzederken, öylesine sirkatini söyledi ki” , bu şahsiyetin “bir müsibeti bin nasihate bedel” oldu... Böylece, Koçgiri’den başlayarak Dersim’le devam eden ve yakın dönemde Elbistan’la başlayıp günümüze gelen tüm Alevi katliamları sorgulanmaya başladı... Bu, bence son derece önemli bir dönemeçtir Alevi toplumu için. Artık Aleviler, Kemalizm’le bir imtihana girdikleri gibi; CHP’ye besledikleri tek yanlı aşkı da terkedeceklerdir. Kısaca, yaşadığımız süreç Alevi toplumu ve Alevilik için bir Milat olabilir...


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